A Blend of Psychology and Comedy | Dr. Kristen Wynns of Wynns Family Psychology

Watch comedy movies, look at reels on Instagram, get a humor book, or find a laughter club. Like, when I did research for my presentation for ncpa, I found out there are laughter clubs, and there's laughter yoga, there's laughter therapy. So there's so many things out there that people can turn to just to pull a little bit of laughter into their day. So I would just encourage people to. To find whatever that is for them, call up their funniest friend and say, I've got to see you. Let's go have drinks. So get out of your comfort zone and just find a way to find daily laughter in your life.

Welcome to the Mental Health Entrepreneur Podcast. We are here to inspire creative ideas and connections for entrepreneurs and advocates working to address our mental health crisis. As you listen, I hope you will experience new ideas and motivation to innovate in your business, your community, and in your life. Welcome back, everyone, to the Mental Health Entrepreneur Podcast. I'm your host, Rachel Harrison, and with me today to talk about an innovative angle to mental wellness is Dr. Kristen Winslow, who is an author, a founder of Winn's Family Psychology, and creator of a comedy show. Welcome, Kristin.

Thank you. Thrilled to be here.

I'm so glad to chat with you. All right, so I know you have a lot of background in psychology and doing therapy and all of those things, but today I want to kind of focus on your new angle of humor as medicine. Can you tell us just a little bit, what are you doing now? What does that look like for you? How are you integrating those two things?

Sure. Yeah. I'm quite passionate about this new hybrid, as I call it, of my. My day job and then my side hustle that's becoming more and more of just a second job. I have had my own private practice for 17 years. We actually have our anniversary next week, which is very exciting. So I've been a psychologist for over 20 years. That is. That is my original passion, helping kids and teens and families. And that's what my practice is founded on. But always, always through the years, I have pulled humor and laughter into my practice. So even when we advertise for a position at my practice, we say, hey, we like to have fun because we do important work, but we also realize that we need an outlet. So we just put it out there that we prank each other and we laugh a lot and we joke a lot. So that's always been a part of my team's culture. And then within my sessions, I've always just still been myself. I can't help but be myself. And I naturally bubbly, laughy person. So I've always joked with my clients as is appropriate. I mean, one of the coolest examples of this is I had a client that I worked with for probably 13, 14 years who had complex PTSD from multiple childhood traumas. So we were in it for the long haul. So even with her, with very deep, painful work for her, you know, over time, when you develop that relationship, we would joke and I would tease her, as is appropriate, we would laugh together. And it was just a part of our work and it's really cool. She recently texted me a promo for one of my comedy shows and she said, why am I not surprised to see this? But then I wrote her back and I was like, oh, lol. Did you know I got into comedy a few years ago? And she wrote back, I didn't, but this doesn't surprise me at all. So even with the work we do as mental health providers, I have seen that when it's used appropriately in the right time and place, humor and laughter, it's just so powerful. And it helps with whatever other healing work we're doing with the therapy or the tackling the trauma. So I've seen that in my personal life too, with having friends who lost a son to suicide, and they would be joking, you know, not. Not about the tragedy itself, but just joking and laughing about memories. And I saw how it helped them really get through such an awful tragedy. So that is sort of my current passion is two years ago, I turned to standup comedy as a way of taking my own advice, where post Covid, I was a hot mess like everybody else. I was stressed and anxious and worried about my practice and worried about my kids and worried about my marriage. So in 2021, I took an improv comedy class and that was fun. But then I sort of morphed into standup comedy and as just a way to take care of myself and do something different. And then it's turned out to be an amazing ride of doing standup comedy. And now, as I'm sure we're going to talk about, I have sort of a new endeavor that's swirling the two together.

Yeah, I can't wait to talk about that. But I want to dig in a little bit deeper to this. We can't really say post Covid, but at some point, through the stress of COVID that you decided to jump here. I mean, it sounds like the improv class was the first step, right? Were you really serious about it when you took that improv class? Or was that just like a little, hey, I'll try this fun thing?

The latter. I just thought, well, improv, like, I like to laugh and this seems like a fun thing just to do for me, you know, I. It was kind of scary, but I'm one of those people that likes to scare myself a bit and do things that are out of my comfort zone. So I didn't beg a friend. I was like, I'm going to do this for myself, just to take a class, learn some new skills and it'll be fun. And I never ever dreamed where that first class would take me.

Yeah. So where was the point or the moment where you really decided, hey, I'm going to take this leap and do standup comedy, like, for real?

It was about a year later, so after doing the improv class, I was thinking, hey, that was fun, but I really wanted to control. I don't know if you know much about improv, but that's more of a team sport, you know, like, who's blind is it? It's multiple people on this stage and they're kind of riffing. And I sort of evolved into wanting to control the content. So then I took a stand up class and loved it where I could write the material and control the content. So one year later, in 2022, I did the scariest thing of my life. And I'm an adrenaline junkie that likes to do the zip lining and parasailing and rock climbing and all that. But the scariest thing of my life, summer of 2022, I did an open mic where you just show up, you throw your name in a hat, literally, they draw your name out, you go up on stage and then you do about four or five minutes of stand up. So wow. I remember the first time being backstage and my. I thought my heart might explode in my chest. I was so scared because comedy is very vulnerable. You know, you're there on this.

You're just the only one up there. Like, you're carrying the whole thing. There's nobody to save you.

That's right. It's not like a singer where maybe they're like, I don't know, is the crowd liking this? If people aren't laughing, it means you're not, you're not getting it. So scared. But I did that first ever open mic. It actually was very, very well received. And then after doing two more, I kind of call it my Cinderella story. It just feels like a fairy tale. But after three open mics, I was booked for a paid show and I was like, does it always happen this way? And as I talked to other comedians, I learned most people don't necessarily have things happen that quickly to do a few open mics where you're just putting yourself out there and then get booked. But after that I just felt like this is something that I can do. I'm good at it. But that reciprocal thing with a crowd and an audience feels like similar to what you get after a great therapy session where therapy is very reciprocal. You know, it's not just about one of you. It's that relationship and the really cool magic that happens between the two of you. So standup comedy felt like in a way where I'm giving of myself, but then the audience is giving back and we all have our endorphins flying at the end of it.

That's fantastic. I love that moment for you. And so this feels like it's leading into almost. I mean, there's this new adventure of standup comedy. And I understand you now have a place locally where you do a show regularly.

Yes, there are a few comedy clubs and in our area in the Triangle in North Carolina, a few really well regarded ones. And then of course there's the local scene where comedy is huge, actually where I live. So any local restaurant or bar or like market. I did a show in a, in a night market last night in downtown Raleigh. So comedy's pretty big here. So in addition to kind of doing the local shows, one of the top comedy clubs in our area has sort of discovered me and had me for a new show that I'm passionate about, highlighting women in comedy. It's called Ladies Laugh Lounge. So I had a sold out show there last week, which is amazing to see support and excitement for women comedians that has led to sort of this ongoing show, hopefully Ladies Laugh Lounge, and then being booked again for an even bigger show at Goodnights in October.

I'm looking at your two passions, right? You've got this therapy practice and yourself as a therapist. And then you've got this standup comedy. And you've already talked about how those two kind of intersect for you. I know you're also an entrepreneur at heart. What are you creating to integrate these two things?

That's really, I guess my dream is to find almost a new genre or a new space for that hybrid. So currently in the middle of developing or I'm doing it, humor coaching and workshops. So it's basically when it comes to a workshop, speaking to an organization or for example, I have our state psych association that's having me participate in their fall conference where I'm teaching on the healing power of humor because a lot of people don't necessarily realize the it's linked to everything with our health. Laughter and humor is linked to people living longer, our immune systems fighting inflammation, better reduction of the stress hormones and then that making us have less anxiety, depression. So I'm presenting to our state association on that topic. But the cool thing is it's not just going to be this standard presentation where I've got my PowerPoints and I'm like this and this. It's going to weave in experiential things to have the audience participating in exercises that are showing them live how laughter helps them feel better. And of course I'm pulling in some stand up type material too. So that's kind of the dream is it's not just this dry presentation, but it's doing experiential things with the crowd to show them how good it feels when we laugh. And then of course on the other side is just one on one humor coaching where I'm now offering sessions for individuals who want to learn how to pull laughter into their relationships, into their workplace, into their day to day lives. And it's sort of, you know, you know what coaching is, Lots of people do coaching now. So it's, it's like your standard coaching but again pulling some of that experiential element into teaching them and showing them how they can, with very little effort, creatively pull more laughter and humor into their lives and then have all of these great blessings follow.

Yeah. So how do you see that impacting mental wellness in the people that interact with maybe the, the folks that you're doing that humor coaching with?

Yeah, I hope it'll actually maybe open up people who might be nervous about traditional therapy or even traditional coaching that might feel intimidating. And I'm really thankful that Covid has helped a lot to destigmatize therapy. I'm so thankful that that was a gift Covid gave us. But still I think there is that nervousness that comes to reaching out for mental health help or sometimes even for coaching. But I'm hoping that humor coaching and someone almost approaching it like I did that improv class, this sounds like something different. This sounds like it could be fun. You know, I'll check it out and see if it helps my workplace team function better or helps me with my relationship struggles or helps my anxiety and sleep. So I'm hoping it is just sort of a new space of something where somebody might want to have a session with Me check it out. And then if they love it and they are starting to see the fruits from that, then I'm kind of offering them in a one and done type session, or if somebody wants to book a package of four or eight sessions, if they really know they want to go all in. But I'm hoping it can really just open up some new doors for people who want help and maybe they don't want to go that traditional path or maybe not that traditional path right now.

Yeah. Well, and I think it's interesting to think about, like, how does this impact workplace. Right. Like workplace teams. Like, I think about almost everyone has some form of a workplace team. So if you're intentionally learning how to incorporate humor and laughter into that team meeting or the team dynamics, how that could really shift. And I think immediately too of our neurobiology, that laughter is one of the things that cues our nervous system, that we're safe, that we can be calm. We like to call it being in the green zone. Right. With polyvagal theory. So thinking about how that could really shift the dynamics in different teams, I mean, I'm even thinking like school teachers, right. How cool would this be to integrate into a school teacher who's leading a classroom? Like, there's lots of just different applications for this. Just simply I'm. I'm thinking of it literally, like dosing humor into situations. Right. Like, I like humor. Laughter is medicine. That kind of idea, a hundred percent.

And I can't remember how big your team is, but, you know, after 17 years of running a business, I find one of the more stressful parts of being a business owner is managing my team and just dealing with interpersonal dynamics between them, between them and me, between management and the team. It's just, it, it has all the potential for stress. So, yes, having humor and laughter, clever hacks to pull into your team, your workplace, and have some of the stress and tension dissipated as a result. I think is. Is very powerful. And I like your. I like your description of dosing because even when I've done presentations on this, there's an exercise I do where it's almost like a deep breathing exercise, but when you exhale, you're laughing, so you breathe in and then you're like. And if you do that with somebody or a group a few times, you have that immediate feeling in your brain of lightness where you're like, oh my gosh, this stuff is magic. I mean, it is truly like you just took medicine that had an immediate effect on your stress level. So it's just incredibly powerful and exciting to think of something that doesn't require equipment, it doesn't require a prescription. It just requires two people in the room together or, you know, a group of people and then magic happens.

I love that. So what would you want this to be? You're saying you want to create a new space. Can you paint me a little bit of a picture of what that ideally would look like down the road five, ten years from now?

Sure. It's sort of the two pronged. So for my standup, I do have a dream that as I hopefully have bigger and bigger platforms on which to perform, that I can actually pull some quick psycho education into my performance. I've done that before with shows where, you know, in the middle of my bits, I'll say something like, thank you guys for coming and acknowledging that laughter is healing and that you guys are all coming here and you'll leave here feeling better. So just, you know, having the opportunity from stage to have quick little notes about educating people about the healing power of laughter and humor. I have that dream on the standup side. And then of course on the psychologist side, it is just developing more and finding a place where humor coaching and workshops and presentations can find footing. Because I know with anything new, sometimes people might be skeptical or there might not even be a place to talk about it. So the goal is to still have maybe my private practice and my psychologist credentials be enough to get some footing and really get in the humor coaching and workshops and presentations going. And then of course still pulling it into my day to day private practice life as well.

Yeah.

Oh, and I'm working on a book. I'm working on a book. I have a really cool writers and residents that I got accepted to this fall, which I'm thrilled about. So I have my parenting book out there, but I have a new book that is on this topic of the merge between the two and it's called Wait, what Was I Feeling Again? And it's basically my journey from part of my comedy is I joke about it, but it's true. I'm a psychologist who outran my own feelings for much of my life where I was like, ambition, success, even being a jokester, laughter, let me just do all the things so I don't ever have to slow down and acknowledge my own feelings and deal with my own childhood stuff so that I joke about that on the stage too. Like, hey, I'm a psychologist. I'm supposed to be good at talking about feelings and I am other people's, not my own so my book is kind of that journey, which is a whole other probably podcast interview of how I used all of these other things to run really fast in the opposite direction of my own feelings. And then having sort of personal awakening a few years ago that that was not going to be successful in the long run. And I just had to slow down enough to do the work myself and to figure out, wait, what am I feeling? And then not just, you know, then go off and do 10 other things, but stay in that moment with the feeling and deal with it. So that is also something I'm excited about, is kind of getting some of this captured in another book that'll hopefully be a different kind of book where you read it and you're laughing and then you're also really inspired for how you can possibly deal with your past or your feelings differently.

I love that. That leads right into my bailiwick of trauma therapist and the mdr.

Yes, I'm sure.

Is there something that you want to leave this audience with in terms of if they're starting something? Creativity, ideas, entrepreneurship? What would be your 2 cents to put out there?

Two quick things jumped to my mind, so I'll just blurt them both out. The first is I can't say enough about getting out of your comfort zone. It's hard for many of us. We want to stay safe and comfortable, even if it's not going well. So I would just encourage people to take a small step out of their comfort zone. It might not mean taking a comedy class. It might mean joining a book club or joining a Facebook group that's a social group or anything that just kind of scares you. I just think that helps us grow so much as humans, and it is good for us. So that. And then just the. The second thing that came to mind is everyone can find small ways to laugh during the day. It's all around us. So I would really just encourage people, especially if they're stressed and going through a tough time, to watch comedy movies, look at reels on Instagram, get a humor book, or find a laughter club. Like when I did research for my presentation for ncpa, I found out there are laughter clubs and there's laughter yoga, there's laughter therapy. So there's so many things out there that people can turn to just to pull a little bit of laughter into their day. So I would just encourage people to find whatever that is for them, call up their funniest friend and say, I've got to see you. Let's go have drink. So those two things get out of your comfort zone and just find a way to find daily laughter in your life.

Love it. Amazing. Well, thank you so much for being here. It was a joy to chat with you and I can't wait to see what comes next.

Thank you. It was a pleasure.